FIA Institute Roll-Hoop Test

[Sublime_FA11C]

Here's a video of a roll-hoop structure being tested against a wheel assembly fired from a cannon. It's less impressive then you might imagine a video involving things fired out of a cannon towards a drivers helmet. Pretty effective, but i cringe a bit at the thought of F1 cars getting any fuglier.

Check it out: http://vimeo.com/40140808

[AndreaModa]

It's so dumb though! Talk about impeding the driver's vision! I thought those silly little wings at Monaco a few years back on the Jordan and Arrows were banned for this reason! I'm all for safety, but this is just dumb.

[dr-baker]

The video seems to make it patently obvious how much it limits the drivers' vision. And it's already restricted enough by the cockpit surround and inadequate rear-view mirrors. It's a good idea in theory but there is no way of adequately implementing this without impeding vision and making accidents more likely.

On Autosport. And shouldn't this be in the Paul Stoddart forum?

[mario]

This is not entirely dissimilar to the research that the FIA carried out into a canopy system that could be implemented - and much like then, I am still concerned that whilst a solution like this may reduce the risk of cranial injuries for the driver, it potentially increased the risk considerably for anybody in the surrounding area. Remember that when the FIA tested a canopy system under similar circumstances, the wheel itself came to rest several hundred metres away?
You end up in a situation where the risk may now be transferred from the driver to marshals or even spectators around the circuit - either that, or you might end up having to increase the height and extent of the debris fencing around the circuit. Added to that, as others have pointed out, putting a metal frame somewhere in front of the driver might potentially impede his vision - at least a canopy system, for example, could be made from transparent materials.

All in all, whilst the FIA do have noble intentions - improved driver safety - I am not entirely sure that this is the best way of going about it, given that there are a number of potential downsides as well.

The video seems to make it patently obvious how much it limits the drivers' vision. And it's already restricted enough by the cockpit surround and inadequate rear-view mirrors. It's a good idea in theory but there is no way of adequately implementing this without impeding vision and making accidents more likely.

On Autosport. And shouldn't this be in the Paul Stoddart forum?

For the moment, I think that this forum would suffice - the research in question may not just be applied to Formula 1 cars, but potentially to other open wheeled series as well. Additionally, I'd associate the PS forum with current developments in F1, whereas there is no guarantee when, or even if, this research would be applied to future F1 cars.

[Sublime_FA11C]

I couldn't decide wheter this was more current F1 or other randomness.

Another issue i have with this thing is that it won't block a little piece of debris, and as mario points out whatever is deflected isn't magically wished away, but is instead going to land god knows where.

[dr-baker]

On Autosport. And shouldn't this be in the Paul Stoddart forum?

For the moment, I think that this forum would suffice - the research in question may not just be applied to Formula 1 cars, but potentially to other open wheeled series as well. Additionally, I'd associate the PS forum with current developments in F1, whereas there is no guarantee when, or even if, this research would be applied to future F1 cars.

OK, fair enough, I accept that reasoning.

And to further the discussion on how far the tyre would be deflected:

The other benefit of the roll hoop design was that the impact deflated the tyre – which meant that it had less chance of being deflected further in subsequent impacts.

"The impact deflated the tyre during both tests," said Mellor. "We tend to think that's a good thing – it means that the wheel doesn't bounce as much. It stops much more quickly if you can deflate the tyre."

How does this affect perception of this structure? It still doesn't solve the visibility issue, but surely it's a small positive over the canopy option?

[Backmarker]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

[pasta_maldonado]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

I agree. If there was a collision, the roll hoop would impede drivers vision further in the smoke. I'd imagine it'd be horrendous in the rain. However I do think that f1 is in danger of becoming too safe. While I support safety for drivers, the FIA won't stop until each driver isin his own impregnable bubble, and the sport would be as safe as going down to the shops. This won't be good for the sport

[Wizzie]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

Once you think about it, the driver could use said rollcage to help them climb out of the cars as well.

[Backmarker]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

I agree. If there was a collision, the roll hoop would impede drivers vision further in the smoke. I'd imagine it'd be horrendous in the rain. However I do think that f1 is in danger of becoming too safe. While I support safety for drivers, the FIA won't stop until each driver isin his own impregnable bubble, and the sport would be as safe as going down to the shops. This won't be good for the sport

But it is also hard to say how much safety is too much. A roll cage on the Formula Two car might have saved Henry Surtees life, a canopy on the F1 car and Massa might not have come so close to death (in admittedly a freak accident), and maybe Dan Wheldon could have been saved by some cockpit protection (but there were other problems with the car and track design at play there). I don't think we should be so attached to having drivers in open cockpits that we are unwilling to look for solutions and if necessary implement them. But as I say, I don't think they have come up with any solutions that would necessarily be safer than the present situation. For a start we've not seen how a roll cage or canopy would stand up if a car crashes, the roll cage will impair vision, the canopy could present difficulties for (for example) extracting a driver from a burning car. I'm not actually sure we'll ever see any of these make it to the cars though.

[dr-baker]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

Once you think about it, the driver could use said rollcage to help them climb out of the cars as well.

Yeah, because they have a real problem with that, don't they? How often have we seen a driver unable to get out of the car and think, "If only they had a roll-over hoop in front of them that they could use?"

[Wizzie]

I also think that a roll cage would have the benefit of not impairing getting drivers out of the cockpit as much as a canopy would. I think it's good the FIA Institute are researching these things, but I don't think they've found the solution yet.

Once you think about it, the driver could use said rollcage to help them climb out of the cars as well.

Yeah, because they have a real problem with that, don't they? How often have we seen a driver unable to get out of the car and think, "If only they had a roll-over hoop in front of them that they could use?"

Martin Brundle had some trouble getting out of the Ferrari F2010 during a recent segment, mind you

[nome66]

how they should test it is put it on an F1 chassis from last year, roll the car, and also shoot the car helmet first at a wall like in an IndyCar wreck to really test the safety.

[dr-baker]

After the startline crash at La Source, this seems to on the radar again...